Tuesday, January 31, 2017

Amoris Laetitia: Brightest and the Best would resign

Image result for Bishops Conference england
Encouraging news from a priest friend.

He was speaking to his bishop about Amoris Laetitia and discussing whether the Bishops Conference will make a statement on the lines of two bishops who make up the Maltese Episcopal Conference. "No", said the Bishop, "not only would there be division, even war amongst the bishops, at least a strong division between the bishops but in his own diocese he knew that several of the younger clergy would resign from their parishes, and be welcomed by other sympathetic bishops. The problem he said would be with the "brightest and the best, the most hard working especially amongst the younger of the diocesan clergy".

It is unfortunate that the Church has been pushed in such a direction but this is where the Church is today, in a fragile vulnerable situation.

22 comments:

M. Prodigal said...

Yes, confusion, division, and the 'mess' that the pope asked for are truly the situation. May Our Blessed Lord intervene.

philipjohnson said...

Fr.It seems to me that the 'mess' Franco wants is exactly what he is going to get.He profanes Marriage;he profanes Confession;he profanes Holy Communion,that will be his undoing.I would not want to face God Almighty with that background!It would appear that he is Hell Bent on confusion and confusion and following an ever depressing fall from Grace.Lord help the Pope in his trials.

Kathleen1031 said...

Hello Father. We don't know if it is going to make any difference at all, but we are hopeful the four Cardinals issue a correction soon. These are wholly disheartening times. At least if a correction is issued the people will officially hear that there are Cardinals who are identifying error and they need to consider what has been said by the pope, is it correct, or is it error. Without that correction, people are going to be increasingly confused, lives will be ruined, and souls will go to Hell.
There is a lot of suffering out here. These men are dabbling and playing with the lives and souls of real people, young people, children. The poor Christians in the Middle East are suffering so greatly, while this pope stands around and says little to nothing about their plight, then chastises Christians who do not want their nations invaded by Muslims. There is so much that is just wrong here.
May God help us and soon.

John Fisher said...

In years gone by Catholics had a knee jerk type of obedience to bishops and the pope. It was based on trust. Rather like trusting a GP but with God thrown in. "Oh I don't know what it means.... but we must obey". " We must obey, we must obey we must obey" Without any realization... if it conflicts with the Faith. One does not abbey one must obstruct. This combined with an overblown view of papal prerogatives had led rather predictably to where we are. A Church with banal manufactured liturgy of rupture. A Church where canon law is not enforced or obeyed. A Church where many of those weather beaten bedraggled clergy who survived the last five decades have no spine and carry the pathogen. Francis asks why there are fewer clergy. Why religious life is declining. He should look at himself and those who backed him. So news that bishops are prepared to fight and resist as well as younger clergy resign is very good news. In years gone by clergy seeing the confusion.. a confusion beyond words just sought solace in other situations such as marriage, liberalism and apostasy. Yes many after leaving religious life and priesthood just gave up. I recall back 30 years ago meeting a very good woman. She told me she had left religious life because she could not go along with all the crazy self destruction as nuns and sisters turned into career women. There will be suffering now in order to prevent greater suffering in the future for others.

Palincor IG said...

I do think it's easy to overjudge.

For example, Francis not saying much about persecuted middle eastern christians. It well established that the Islamic State does not tolerate well such criticism and steps up massacre in revenge for being criticized. So efforts on their behalf must, necessarily go behind the scenes.






Physiocrat said...

Are we seeing the end of the Catholic church? We have always assumed that the church, under the leadership of the Bishop of Rome, is the main branch, but this rests ultimately on an interpretation of Matthew 16:18. What if we are wrong?

The nearest the church has come to collapse before was when the Arian heresy was rampant. The Roman church has never had to face such a thing alone.

What if we are wrong in our interpretation and the main stem is the churches of present nine Orthodox patriarchates? It is a disturbing thought. How is one to know? And what is one to conclude when we compare our parsimonious liturgy with theirs?

Nicolas Bellord said...

Time for us all to write to our Bishops protesting.

Recusant said...

Kathleen1031

Cardinal Muller, the Secretary of the CDF has made a reply of sorts in an interview this week. Sandro Magister has the details today: http://magister.blogautore.espresso.repubblica.it/2017/02/01/the-pope-is-silent-but-cardinal-muller-speaks-who-responds-to-the-%e2%80%9cdubia%e2%80%9d-this-way/

Recusant said...

Kathleen 1031

Cardinal Muller of the CDF has made a response of sorts this week in an interview. Sandro Magister has it today:http://magister.blogautore.espresso.repubblica.it/2017/02/01/the-pope-is-silent-but-cardinal-muller-speaks-who-responds-to-the-%e2%80%9cdubia%e2%80%9d-this-way/

Nicolas Bellord said...

A must read:

http://magister.blogautore.espresso.repubblica.it/2017/02/01/the-pope-is-silent-but-cardinal-muller-speaks-who-responds-to-the-%e2%80%9cdubia%e2%80%9d-this-way/

Cardinal Muller seems to have answered the dubia talking of the sophistry of certain bishops - presumably meaning the Bishops in Malta and elsewhere. He supports orthodoxy; specifically Familiaris Consortio.

Et Expecto said...

Does the Catholic Bishops' Conference of England and Wales have any public views on anything nowadays? They used to have a press conference after each of their meetings, I don't think that this has happened for years. That is probably because they are disunited - the old school against the more recent appointments. Maybe we will have to wait for the oldies to retire before they start speaking with one voice.

Et Expecto said...

Does the Catholic Bishops' Conference of England and Wales have any public views on anything nowadays? They used to have a press conference after each of their meetings, I don't think that this has happened for years. That is probably because they are disunited - the old school against the more recent appointments. Maybe we will have to wait for the oldies to retire before they start speaking with one voice.

Nicolas Bellord said...

At a cost of €3 and hours of dealing with a very dodgy website I have managed to get a copy of Cardinal Muller's interview in Il Tempo in Italian. My Italian is rudimentary but as far as I can see what he says about Amoris Laetitia is entirely orthodox. Basically he says that you really cannot take a footnote as justifying communion for the divorced and remarried and that Familiaris Consortio remains the teaching of the Church. He says that any confusion has arisen because of individual interpretations by some Bishops.

So what is all this about? The four Cardinals submitted their dubia. The Pope has made clear he is not going to answer and furthermore he has not asked the CDF (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith of which Cardinal Muller is the head) to comment. So there is nothing coming out from the CDF. But here we have Cardinal Muller giving an interview, presumably in his personal capacity and not as Prefect of the CD, which seems to contradict the indorsement which Pope Francis gave to the heterodox views of the Buenos Aires Bishops.

I see this as a direct challenge to Pope Francis. What will happen next? Cardinal Muller sacked and replace by Cardinal Schonborn?

Michael Leahy said...

John Fisher, it seems to me that the 'good woman' you mention did not leave religious life but rather that it left her.

Lepanto said...

Now (1/2/17) the German bishops have issued their permission for the divorced and 'remarried' to receive the Blessed Sacrament under certain conditions. Blessed Catherine Emmerich prophesied a situation in which "....It seems to me that a concession was demanded from the clergy which could not be granted. I saw many older priests, especially one, who wept bitterly. A few younger ones were also weeping. But others, and the lukewarm among them, readily did what was demanded. It was as if people were splitting into two camps.”

JARay said...

I have just read on Fr. Z's blog that the four Confraternities of Catholic Clegy have come out strongly in favour of the 5 Dubia asked of the Pope. They want a clear answer which is entirely in line with the traditional teaching of the Church. Reading this has brought joy to my heart. I know that I must renew my membership of the Australian C.C.C. as a lay supporter. I also continue with my prayers for the Pope to come out with clear support for the traditional teaching and for him to do what Emeritus Pope Benedict did and retire. I bear no animosity towards the Pope but I do hope that he will step down soon. He has caused more than enough "mess" and I certainly don't want any more.

geneticallycatholic said...

I think the pope has very little self-awareness. He asks people to make "a mess" and sows confusion, and then wonders why there are so few vocations? Really?

I don't think that he makes an Examen of Conscience- that is so much a part of Ignatian Spirituality. He is incredibly deluded. I pray for him daily, but I hope his pontificate does not last long. May he go in peace ... and leave faithful prelates and laity to sort out the mess.

geneticallycatholic said...

Btw, welcome back Father. It's great to read your posts again.

Sixupman said...

My own English diocesan bishops promotes Franciscus and Amoris Laetitia - whilst at one and the same time closing parishes and promoting a laity led diocese and Permanent Diaconate - he also scoffs at priets wating time in the Confessional.

David O'Neill said...

Thank you for that Father. Has not the Pope already expressed himself as wishing to split the Church? If so now is a good time while we still have the FSSP & ICKSP (& hopefully soon the SSPX) for honest priests to go to. If our own bishops are so divided & fearful what hope is there for the laity other than to seek true Catholic teaching wherever it can be found.
O Lord save Your Church!!!

Palincor IG said...

I would say to Physiocrat that there are several branches of the Russian Orthodox church who are no longer in communion with each other, this is occurred in the 20th century and continues today.

Many Orthodox Churches have divorce and remarriage as established practice, and although all christian denominations forbade contraception till the 1930's, it is Orthodox (at least Russian Orthodox) policy to allow it in many cases.

The case is even worse in Protestantism.

Sadie Vacantist said...

The Church is in a state of emergency. Time to beatify Lefebvre.